Deliverance - 20 days? Track it internally?

[Dave]

Hey all,
Just thinking about GM adventures, and the Deliverance ability that can be used every 20 days. Are there adventures in book 13-20 that last *longer* than 20 days? Such that LW would be able to reset this skill? It would seem to necessitate some kind of internal tracking, which will add quite a bit of work...

Or would just a simple "used it on this adventure", which resets each book be okay?

[Honza]

Books 13 and 14 last less than 20 days, so there should be Deliverance boost used once per book.

In book 15, it takes 4 days to get to the temple of Antah, and then you are digging out for 15 days (section 156). So maybe you could use Deliverance once before being buried in the temple, and once after that.

Books 16 and 17 don't last longer than 20 days, I think.

In book 18, you leave Vadera at "late winter’s day" (section 1), and the adventure is finished at the Feast of Fehrmarn (the first day of spring). In book 15 section 1 is written that Lord Floras travelled from Vadera to Sommerlund for "more than a month". So maybe you could also use Deliverance twice in this book (assuming that the first use was early in the book). For example, if you use Deliverance for the first time before you abandon Nathor in Scade, you could use it again after you reach Holmgard.

Book 19 doesn't last 20 days - although it does last 1 year Aon-time

Don't know how long lasts book 20 (even in Aon-time), so maybe Deliverance once a book again. However, in book 20 you could explicitly use Deliverance in-game (after fighting Zantaz) - so maybe this option should be grayed out if you use Deliverance before fighting Zantaz.

[Rusty Radiator]

Great answer!
I always thought that it should be possible to do it twice on some books- else why specify that it has shortened from 50 to 20 days......

However, consider this. It cuts both ways- don't 20 and 18 follow on straight after the book before? In which case surely you should continue the timer from the point in the previous book where you last used it.

[outspaced]

FWIW, since you restore your ENDURANCE points total to maximum between books--even if one immediately follows another--there is realistically no way you could legally use the Deliverance ability more than once per book. By the time your EP drops to 8, you should be way past halfway through the adventure, and 20 days won't elapse before the end of the adventure. However, it can easily be assumed that 20 days will have passed between your using the ability in Book x and your having a low enough EP score to use it in Book x+1, even with crappy RNT picks.

The only caveat is Book 19 -> Book 20. But even that can be explained away as the time differential between two different Planes of Existence. So I'd recommend making it easier on yourself and limiting it to just once per adventure.

[Snowshadow]

There was a discussion about this on Mongoose Publishing's site a couple of years ago

forum.mongoosepublishing.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=41725&start=15

The general feeling was Deliverence's +20EP was permitted once per adventure whereas Curing's equivalent was every other adventure.

Personally I like to keep a tally! But I'd be in favour of once per adventure for simplicity's sake.

When I read book 12 I always assumed LW was trapped in suspended animation for years whilst travelling through the gate but this can't be right as Alyss & Kekataag, etc. haven't moved in the 'year' it takes between 19-20. Otherwise it could be argued you can only use Deliverence once between both Book 19-20

It might be worth keeping track for the New Order series though, certainly Bk 21 is very hard and I don't know offhand if it takes the 20 days or not. Though the problem is Book 22 begins only a few days after Book 21, luckily Book 23 tells us you have been on Lorn for weeks. Book 25 immediately follows 24, Book 28 immediately follows 27 so keeping a tally would be tricky if you were to follow the books literally.

Otherwise you could have stated that the Grand Master requires a period of 20 days consecutive rest - normal light monastery duties, etc. certainly not adventuring; a bit like you cannot use Healing/Curing during a section with combat. This would stop people using twice per adventure. Pity.

Stick to once per adventure, if people don't like it they can do it 'their way' in the books - either that or add an option in the rules as to which version of Deliverence they prefer, though that would mean you would have to keep tally.

[Snowshadow]

Just had an idea. Rather than tally perhaps you could reset Deliverence at specific points in the 'longer' Books? Plus of course reset it at the end of a book.

Book 15 - Lone Wolf spends two weeks buried in the Temple of Antah, you could reset Deliverence here (if it gets used prior to this, say for example against the Gorodon).

Book 18 - When Lone Wolf reaches the Kai Monastery and bathes in the light of the Lorestones you could arguably reset Deliverence here.

Book 21 - Temujun (and/or his Ring) could reset Deliverence or placing items on that altar in Gologo...

Book 23 - Tomb of the Paladin.

So if the book describes a long period of time, a meeting with a significant good NPC or an opportunity to partake in a holy observance perhaps it could be reset but absolutley Deliverence shouldn't be allowed more than twice per adventure, unless of course Bk 32 takes a year, literally!

Just some ideas.

[Dave]

I like the idea of having Deliverance only usable once per book (makes life way simpler for me!) And I could include a loyalty bonus of using Curing once per book, too, if they've completed the Magnakai series prior to doing to GM series.

[Rusty Radiator]

Mar 26, 2012 14:18:17 GMT Dave said:

I like the idea of having Deliverance only usable once per book (makes life way simpler for me!) And I could include a loyalty bonus of using Curing once per book, too, if they've completed the Magnakai series prior to doing to GM series.

Or once per 2 books, as it's a slightly longer period specified....

[Snowshadow]

Just a totally different idea for Healing/Curing/Deliverence and all the problems it raises. (I know this wouldn't really be doable for seventh sense but just an idea).

Kai can only restore a maximum EP equal to their Initial EP in each adventure by Disciplines/Skills. Next to the Discipline/Skill on the Action Chart you could keep a note of the amount of remaining EP the Kai could heal this adventure {Call it Restorable EP}. This is in addition to any text-specific Healing which should not be counted, e.g. Fire on the Water '240' You can Restore your ENDURANCE POINTS to their Initial value if you have the Kai Discipline of Healing on board the Green Sceptre so this does not count towards your adventure limit neither does your demonstration of Healing to 'Ronan' in the same book. Note Permanent reductions to EP, e.g. Using Helshezag, only effect the limit of Restorable EP if the Initial EP becomes lower, in which case reduce the Restorable EP total until it equals the reduced Initial ENDURANCE POINTS.

Healing (self) may only be used when the Kai Lord has at least half Initial EP remaining (Round down)*.
Curing may be used regardless of remaining EP.
Archmaster's Curing Battleheal up to +20EP/Deliverence up to +20EP** is included in this but has the advantage of course of being used in combat - all other Healing must be done as stated in a section without Combat.

*So 29EP Lone Wolf with Initial 25EP wearing Chainmail Waistcoat +4EP could use Healing to Restore up to 25EP in total in an adventure provided his current ENDURANCE POINTS were 12EP or higher, i.e. Do not count Armour.
** An Unarmoured New Order Grand Master with 32EP may use Deliverence to heal up to +20EP and the remaining +12EP Restored via +1EP each Section without Combat, without using Deliverence they could restore 32EP through Non-combat sections. If the Grand Master had used Curing through Non-combat sections to Heal 22EP, then Deliverence would only give the remaining +10EP, for example.

• It wouldn't matter where EP loss came from now - e.g. EP loss through starvation - as the ability is capped.
  
• Healing vs Curing - previously a Kai Master may not bother about Curing if Healing is the same but with only Curing being able to be used when the Kai is severely wounded, a Master may rethink his choices.
  
• Gives New Order Grand Masters, especially those without Deliverence, a chance where before they were limited to +10EP through Curing alone.
  
• We're less likely to worry about counting days for Deliverence if there is a cap to Healing as it is more than likely that Curing will be using up all the restorable EP in the meantime (by the time the 20 days are up there are no Restorable EPs left).
  

Curious to know what others may think.

[jdubs1211]

I like that idea.. I definitely tend to put off Curing due to the reasons you have stated

[Snowshadow]

Mar 31, 2012 14:59:28 GMT jdubs1211 said:

I like that idea.. I definitely tend to put off Curing due to the reasons you have stated

Thanks, me too!

A couple of Optional, very optional, ideas.

• EP gained from MAGICAL Armour, e.g. Silver Bracers +2CS +1EP, MAY be included in your Restorable EP.
  
• If you possess Deliverance, and therefore are a Master of Battlehealing, you may use Curing in ANY Section; including those featuring Combat (and other 'Action' Paragraphs if you feel you would not get the opportunity), after all the ability is still capped.