andyr
Kai Lord
Posts: 122
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Post by andyr on May 25, 2005 9:24:21 GMT
well, something that nobody pointed out is that things get... stolen from the Kai Monastery. I am thinking of an unimportant trifle as the Book of the Magnakai! Sommerlund is the first bulwark against Darklands invasion / espionage /plots (they share a borderline). If there's only one relic of good which can destroy Darklords, I see that entrusting it to a king who lives in a mountain-locked city and in a country which is separated by the rest of the world by sea or desert could sound like a good idea.. You need it sometime? well, send a Lord to grab it and come back with the blade unsheathed and protected by a whole fleet! It did not work that bad... even the Helghasts did not manage to go past the Tarnalin. Those Durenese seem to be better at protecting stuff than anybody else.
As for LW keeping it after Zagarna's destruction... well, he is the last of the Kai, so the situation becomes a bit exceptional, like giving the poor guy a boost (especially when he is the only person in the world who can use it).
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Post by Zipp on May 25, 2005 18:19:13 GMT
Unfortunately, the bonus was too high and totally unbalanced the fights for a large part of the remainder of the series.
But that's besides the point. Plot wise, I agree with Andyr.
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andyr
Kai Lord
Posts: 122
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Post by andyr on May 25, 2005 23:10:32 GMT
Yep, it unbalances the series *selectively* (books 3, 4, 5 6, 7, 8). Funny, but starting around book 9 with our friend the Zakhan, the fights start to be unbalanced *without* the Sommerswerd... One could do OK more or less in books 10-15 (most of the big fights could be evaded), but I do not see a way of getting around books 16 onwards without the blade (too many Lavas, Tagazin, etc etc). Yesterday I finished Deathlord of Ixia, and honestly Ixiataaga was not so tough. The hard part was to get there with more than 15 EP to be able to Kai-Blast him and keep up Kai-Surge while the Sommerswerd minces him (but the fights with Tagazin and friends almost did me). I don't see a way of beating all those CS 50+ dudes without the blade and without going down to EP 4 or so in each encounter...
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Post by Zipp on May 26, 2005 0:14:42 GMT
Laguna brought up an interesting point. How were the kai lords fighting darklords without the use of magical weapons?
And it brings to my mind this question: Besides Vashna and Zagarna, did any of the darklords prior to Book 1 of Lone Wolf ever launch an assualt/campaign outside of the darklands?
Obviously there are reasons for them not to do this, just like commanders rarely take part in actual fighting. Besides this basic fact, they also found the air, um, bad.
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Post by Relenoir on May 26, 2005 2:20:39 GMT
Laguna brought up an interesting point. How were the kai lords fighting darklords without the use of magical weapons? And it brings to my mind this question: Besides Vashna and Zagarna, did any of the darklords prior to Book 1 of Lone Wolf ever launch an assualt/campaign outside of the darklands? Obviously there are reasons for them not to do this, just like commanders rarely take part in actual fighting. Besides this basic fact, they also found the air, um, bad. First question: I'd say the Kai Lords were not concerned with fighting against the Darklords, but fighting against their minions. So it wasn't such a big deal to fight them without magic weapons, and the Darklords basically 'stayed at home' while the minions fought. Second question: as far as I know, no; no other Darklords launched campaigns outside of the Darklands. The MC has nothing about it in the timeline, I don't ever remember reading anything to that effect, and because those two were really the only Darklords who were 'Archlord' of the Darklands before the days of LW, I think this is fairly accurate.
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Post by Laguna Blade on May 26, 2005 6:39:15 GMT
First question: I'd say the Kai Lords were not concerned with fighting against the Darklords, but fighting against their minions. So it wasn't such a big deal to fight them without magic weapons, and the Darklords basically 'stayed at home' while the minions fought. Well thought. But what the situation if the minions were indeed magical, such as undead ghouls, vordaks, helghast, etc..etc...Did they just use normal weapon then? But come to think about it again, the book emphasised about using magical weapon (magic spear etc.) to fight magical minions (Helghast for instance) only in book 2, FOTW. Later in book 5, SOTS, LW could basically take out Vordak without the magic spear. So if one started playing book 5, the player could never have Sommerswerd, Magic Spear or Dagger of Vashna.....but still took out undead.... Allright, you guys might say, Vordaks and Helghasts are not the same. But what about this: in book 8, TJOH where LW took out some Helghasts in one of the sections. Assuming LW either left all magical weapons (Sommerswerd, Dagger of Vashna, Magic Spear, Jewelled Mace, etc) or the player starts with book 8, could LW basically beat'em all? My oh my....we're way off topic now...the subject is moonstone dilemma...... ;D
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Post by outspaced on May 26, 2005 9:11:39 GMT
The MC has nothing about it in the timeline, I don't ever remember reading anything to that effect Well, there is that odd reference on page 5 (page 7 of the PA edition!) in MS 4219: "The Siege of the Kai Monastery". Thing is, it doesn't say who was holding it under siege, or why. Could have been time-share salesmen, I suppose.
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Post by North Star on May 26, 2005 13:55:06 GMT
Time-share salesmen? Of course, it was the two Helghast businessmen insisting on selling them shares in Naar Industries 4200, a forward-looking company looking to promote the Darklands and spin away its bad reputation....
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Post by Zipp on May 26, 2005 17:59:02 GMT
Well, there is that odd reference on page 5 (page 7 of the PA edition!) in MS 4219: "The Siege of the Kai Monastery". Thing is, it doesn't say who was holding it under siege, or why. Could have been time-share salesmen, I suppose. I thought the seige was where Zagarna sent a huge mass of giaks against the monastery, which was won when the kai archers targetted the giak leaders. Seeing their leaders fall, whole hordes of giaks turned and fled. It was the main reason Zagarna began using Gourgaz to lead his giak armies.
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Post by North Star on May 26, 2005 20:32:23 GMT
MS 4219 was when Zagarna seized power by defeating three of his rivals and assuming the position of Archlord. He then launched an all-out attack on Sommerlund, attacking the Monastery and countless other outlying farms and villages. Although only the Kai Monastery survived the initial onslaught, the Monastery held firm and the Dark Muster was beaten back and defeated so thoroughly that the Darklands did not even try to invade again for over a century.
NS.
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Post by outspaced on May 26, 2005 20:49:14 GMT
Was that before or after he dissolved the Rump Parliament and indicted the king for tyranny?
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Post by North Star on May 26, 2005 21:34:10 GMT
That sounds like an English Civil War reference to me, Outs. You should know that the real world does not penetrate the mystic fog of PA!
NS.
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Post by Elephant on May 29, 2005 4:20:33 GMT
But what about this: in book 8, TJOH where LW took out some Helghasts in one of the sections. Assuming LW either left all magical weapons (Sommerswerd, Dagger of Vashna, Magic Spear, Jewelled Mace, etc) or the player starts with book 8, could LW basically beat'em all? Actually, I think Book 8 deals with this without a loophole. IIRC, that's the adventure where Lord Paido accompanies you, and if you don't have the Sommerswerd, Paido's magical blue steel blade enables you to best the Helghast.
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Post by Smyslov on May 30, 2005 20:29:01 GMT
Sommerland should make allies with someone that knows how to get stuff done. For example, Nadziranim. They should have exchanged the Sommerswerd for a six-pack of Zejar-dulagas ;D
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Post by Dusk Fox on May 31, 2005 1:51:43 GMT
After reading all of these posts and the entire convoluted mess of threads it created, I must ask--does anyone know what was actually up with the Moonstone?
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