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Post by Black Cat on Jun 11, 2004 23:47:59 GMT
Huh...I found something that disturbed me a lot. I don't know if it's like that in all the versions (maybe it's just a mistake), but in the French version of LW, in the New Order's adventures, it is said that you become a Supreme GM after you gain your 15th discipline. The problem is...there's 16 disciplines in the New Order! So, do you become a Supreme GM even if you still need to learn one more discipline or is it just a mistake? Did Joe planned to make the last adventure in the New Order series with the Grand Master as a Supreme GM? Can someone shed light on this?
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Post by outspaced on Jun 12, 2004 8:33:48 GMT
Huh...I found something that disturbed me a lot. I don't know if it's like that in all the versions (maybe it's just a mistake) It's actually in all of the UK editions of the New Order series. I spotted it the first time I read Voyage of the Moonstone back in '94, and assumed it was a typo. But it then went on to appear in all subsequent books. The only thing I can think of is that in Book 32 the new Supreme Master would face a truly terrifying adversary, like Vashna or Agarash reborn. I can't see how it is a mistake when it appears in all eight of the published books. But that doresn't mean I'm right!
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Post by Ghost Bear on Jun 12, 2004 9:43:36 GMT
The army of Sommerlund is comprised of several different parts. The Naval fleet, a standing army comprising of both the Border Rangers and the Royal Guard, Townsmen Regiments and forces comprised of men from the fiefdoms of Knights of the Realm.
Men are recruited into the standing armies and trained by their local Lord (a Knight of the Realm or a Baron).
The Townsmen Regiments are formed by men of the city guilds and led by their Guildmarshals.
In times of war, Knights of the Realm might be asked by their Baron to send a force of troops consisting of 200 men, called a 'Charge'. Several charges are commanded by a Baron, and this unit is called a Cassel, and 3-5 Cassels form an army.
Presumably then, there are no army ranks (such as Captain) in the citizen soldier force. Rather, I'd assume that the Charge is commanded by the Knight of the Realm (or maybe one of his family if he's too old). I guess there would probably be Sergeants in this kind of force.
Command of the Cassel is given to a Baron as I mentioned already, and I guess that command of the army as a whole might be given to a senior Baron or experienced Knight of the Realm. Also command might be given to other senior officers, such as the Warmarshal of the Royal Estates (currently Lone Wolf but previously Prince Pelathar).
Before the massacre of the Kai (and presumably this has been reinstated since the creation of the Second Order), the Kai form their own Cassel of mounted and unmounted warriors, and Kai Masters are given command of armies (I'm not sure if every army raised would have been commanded by a Kai Master though).
All of this information comes from the Magnamund Companion - apart from the bits where I 'presume' stuff. Hope it helps.
-GB
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Post by Storm Dancer on Jun 12, 2004 11:17:26 GMT
I'm pretty curious about the implications for the GM systen itself - one of the things I'm going to pick up when there's time is that thread about advanced New Order abilities... I reckon it'd be fun to make a few suggestions and see if people agree. Thoughts in the meantime: If 15 skills is SM, what is 16? Do the skills get bonuses for SM level as well (I'd assume so)? Do they get bonuses for the uber-beyond-SM-rank? And I'm still wondering what other benefits came with SM, besides weapon-crafting!
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Post by The Wytch-King on Jun 12, 2004 11:51:33 GMT
I can't see how it is a mistake when it appears in all eight of the published books. You mean like this? ;D [/B] [...] If, whilst in combat, their COMBAT SKILL is reduced to 8 points or less [...][/ul] And I'm still wondering what other benefits came with SM, besides weapon-crafting! Oh, Sunwolf already pointed out a web page with information about that, but I think that was before your time with us ... Here you go for that thread ... The Wytch-King, who maybe has had a court jester for breakfast ...
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Post by outspaced on Jun 12, 2004 13:22:39 GMT
[/B] [...] If, whilst in combat, their COMBAT SKILL is reduced to 8 points or less [...][/ul][/quote] But that only apeared in a couple of the Grand Master books and was picked up by the editors and/or the fans by Book 17. It was also clarified in a Lone Wolf Club Newsletter. The Grand Master ranks in the New Order series wasn't ever addressed. The Newsletter died (we think) around the release of Rune War, which is Book 24, so there was plenty of time for this issue to be addressed . . . but it wasn't. That's why I'd guess it's not a typo--but as I said, I could be wrong. This of course shows that I did think quite carefully about my original response. Silly Wytch-King!
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Post by The Wytch-King on Jun 12, 2004 14:48:20 GMT
But that only apeared in a couple of the Grand Master books [...] You sure? All right, at first I only thought I had heard/read somewhere that this mistake was rather long-lived, but now I went to check my books. Even my UK copy of The Curse of Naar has that error ... BTW, the clarification in the Newsletters was known to me - just thought that errors in the rules section had a good chance of surviving for a very long time, especially in those rules that were only reprinted. Well, apart from the example of my copy mentioned above, maybe this mistake was not as easy to notice? I have to admit to a certain silliness when posting that, but astonishingly enough, my point does still stand ... The Wytch-King
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Post by outspaced on Jun 12, 2004 15:26:01 GMT
You sure? All right, at first I only thought I had heard/read somewhere that this mistake was rather long-lived, but now I went to check my books. Even my UK copy of The Curse of Naar has that error ... Now I've checked my copy of The Curse of Naar, you're right--it does contain this error. I could have sworn it was fixed in Book 17 . . . but apparently not. This does throw the New Order Rank issue into a new light. Even so, I'd have thought it would have been addressed in the Club Newsletter at some point. Oh well, I'm off to crawl under a rock somewhere. Ah, screw it. I'm too arrogant to feel embarrassed over making a mistake! ;D
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Post by The Wytch-King on Jun 12, 2004 15:37:47 GMT
Ah, screw it. I'm too arrogant to feel embarrassed over making a mistake! ;D That's the spirit! ;D The Wytch-King, relieved to have that rock still free for his own use - just in case
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Post by Black Cat on Jun 13, 2004 22:46:34 GMT
The only thing I can think of is that in Book 32 the new Supreme Master would face a truly terrifying adversary, like Vashna or Agarash reborn. I can't see how it is a mistake when it appears in all eight of the published books. But that doresn't mean I'm right! Well, since the last 4 books are not written yet, why don't Joe add another adventure, a 33th book to the series? Then, with that last book, the Kai Lord would be a real Supreme GM, with all the 16 disciplines, and it would make us, the hardcore fans, very, very happy
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Post by Peregrine on Jun 14, 2004 2:35:16 GMT
All of this information comes from the Magnamund Companion - apart from the bits where I 'presume' stuff. Hope it helps. That's exactly what I was thinking of! Thanks. I wouldn't want to assume too much about the internal organisation of the troops within a charge, but just to nitpick, I'll point out that there probably aren't "sergeants" as such. Historically, a sergeant was a professional soldier - a commoner, but better than peasant militia. So you'd find whole units comprised of sergeants, typically fighting in support of noble troops and their men-at-arms. Just my pedantic streak showing. ;D
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Post by Black Cat on Jun 15, 2004 0:16:51 GMT
The only thing I can think of is that in Book 32 the new Supreme Master would face a truly terrifying adversary, like Vashna or Agarash reborn. The new Supreme Master and a terrible danger? With Lone Wolf, there would be 2 Supreme GMs. And 2 Supreme GMs against a supreme enemy, what a story it would be! (ok, these rhymes suck . For that, I am sorry ) Fighting side by side with Lone Wolf would be very cool, kinda Darth Maul vs Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi in Star Wars Episode I. But I don't think Joe would make LW die...or would he dare?
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Post by Relenoir on Jun 15, 2004 3:17:36 GMT
The new Supreme Master and a terrible danger? With Lone Wolf, there would be 2 Supreme GMs. And 2 Supreme GMs against a supreme enemy, what a story it would be! (ok, these rhymes suck . For that, I am sorry ) Fighting side by side with Lone Wolf would be very cool, kinda Darth Maul vs Qui-Gon Jinn and Obi-Wan Kenobi in Star Wars Episode I. But I don't think Joe would make LW die...or would he dare? Final passage in LW#33: You draw your weapon and point it at your opponent, bellowing [glow=red,2,300]Lone Wolf! There can be only one![/glow] Your life and ill-thought-out attempt at a coup end here.
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andyr
Kai Lord
Posts: 122
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Post by andyr on Jun 15, 2004 5:49:15 GMT
I spent some speculative nights checking out the material in books 21-28 to see the typical Joe Dever "lingering plot elements", that is, an item or character that seems important but does not have a complete usage or fulfillment in that book but on a next one...
I did my lists a couple years ago, and now I've forgotten most. I only have one that I remember:
the GM would travel to Lourden, as he can make friends with a Lourden guy in one of the books and he offers his hospitality back home...
Could we maybe come together with a list of other lingering plotlines, people and items... the Vassagonian girl has been already pointed out, it seems likely that the GM would return to Ghol Tabras at some point, but on what situation, that's unclear.
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Post by Black Cat on Jun 15, 2004 18:03:59 GMT
Well, besides the guy from Lourden and Oriah the Vassagonian girl (and her husband), there's few other characters that might be coming back (SPOILER ALERT): Vandyan, who ran away after book 24, the Slovian soldier that the GM liberated in the same book, and maybe also Delissa, the girl that helped the GM to escape from Duadon. I could name also Ulonga from book 22, the Elder Magi of Port Of Suhn, the 3 Kirludins sailors from book 21, King Karvas, the Captain of the sky ship in book 23, and maybe also Xaol from book 25 (before dying, he said that he'll be back to take his revenge, maybe like Cadak). That's it, that's all I can think of returning characters. But like a lot of people think (like me), Agarash might be in the middle of a plot for the last book because of all the little hints given in the precedent books.
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