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Post by luksa on Jun 3, 2013 23:27:49 GMT
Hello,
I was wondering, why there are so few Gamebooks similar in the neatly thought through gameplay as Lone Wolf. When I compare standard Fighting Fantasy to Lone Wolf, they most lack the depths of character progression (because of LW being a series) and viable starting choices (LW abilities) which make every gameplay a bit different. Not to mention specific Battle system (but that is not the point of my question).
So my question is, are those two specifics copyright secured? If I for instance would like to create a contemporary Gamebook series, which would certainly have a character progression (between book advancements) and abilities (some of them could certainly be thought of as very similar to LW's since those are quite common skills), which would be gained throughout the books and of course would dramatically change the gameplay so the starting choices would matter, am I not allowed to do this commercially due to some copyright? I started to wonder about this question some time ago, whether it is even possible to reanimate the Gamebook world with some infusion of modern Boardgames Gameplay (where the games are similar to each other and no copyright issues are the case), due to the legal stuff. I have some stuff already planned with many gameplay tweaks, original combat system and story, but need to get this one answered before I could proceed further.
And yes, for now, let's suppose I want to distribute it commercially. (so that the print at least pays itself) Thanks for any advice or info about this. Like I said, with boardgames, this is usually not an issue.
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Post by Dave on Jun 4, 2013 4:59:42 GMT
I'm no copyright lawyer, but I'm fairly certain that you cannot copyright something so general as what you are describing. For instance, Tetris was a *very* succesful computer game, but while the company who made it could copyright the name and actual program itself, they couldn't copyright the *idea* of a vertical scolling stack it up game. So, countless copy-cats have been made, and as long as they don't include "-tris" in the title, they can make the overall gameplay identical in concept to Tetris. Usually, identical = slightly boring/unoriginal, so people will add little touches here and there to make it fresh - which is excatly what you are proposing to do with your game books. Sounds like perfectly safe territory, just don't use the exact same names for every skill - e.g. "Hunting" is so generic, that would be fine, but "Mindblast" should be renamed to something else (doesn't even have to be generic), like "Psychic Spike" or "Brain fart" or something. Just my two cents... (okay, more like 50 cents)
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Post by outspaced on Jun 4, 2013 9:18:01 GMT
There were a number of gamebook series that allowed a reader to play the same character across multiple books, e.g. Steve Jackson's Sorcery!, Blood Sword by Dave Morris and Oliver Johnson, Way of the Tiger by Mark Smith and Jamie Thomson (which also included 'special ninja skills' similar to Kai Disciplines), Falcon (by the same authors), The Cretan Chronicles by Butterfield, Honigmann and Parker to name a few.
So there is no copyright issue with writing a series of books that allows a player to continue from one book to another. Of course, you would need to invent a new set of rules (or utilise one released under a free license) to do so: you couldn't use the Lone Wolf rules in your books and then sell them.
The problem is effectively balancing the difficulty levels; each book would need to be doable by both a novice and a veteran, and provide an interesting, challenging adventure for both.
Hope it helps!
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Post by luksa on Jun 4, 2013 10:28:47 GMT
I can only say thank you to both. I have basically the same opinion as Dave does, it seems to me this system is quite general to be copyrighted, yet I wanted the confirmation, that I just do not imagine it. Of course, the names of the skills would be different, except probably to some very general names like you suggested "Hunting" - but this exactly will probably not appear in the books (to name a few Occult Sciences, Athletics, Extreme Survival etc.). The main thing that is copyrighted is the story I suppose, which of course is not something any sensible person would get into copying. So, yes, good to hear this. (and probably Battle system which I already have changed - it will possibly feature no randomization, but I may still add it later) Thank you also for the list of the Gamebook series, I only know Sorcery, the others are completely unknown to me. The rules are what this is about. Abilities (if this a general enough term) - I already mentioned them before, Attributes - in my case possibly Strength, Health, Stamina and Resource (which starts to be used in the second half of the first book) and different Battle system. Abilities = one can hardly differ when it comes to using abilities (having them helps you overcome some obstacles along the way). Some differences can still be made for instance one could get some bonuses for different situations, but even this was sometimes introduced in LW... but I hope this one is not a problem. Attributes = Strength decides the combat effectivity (yes, very similar, but again that should not be a problem, it is general enough), Health just decides when you die, like every Gamebook does. Stamina can be used to enchance battle abilities, so it is a supportive attribute that makes some difference. And at last Resource which makes some interesting tweaks to the gameplay I would just not go into now. Let us just say that this one deffinitely has no real counterpart (and I still work on it, since it will be used fairly often in later part of the first book and other books if I get that far). Battle system = to differ one has to change the basics - some randomization should again pose no problem, if I in the end go into that. A table to help you evaluate the results should be no problem as well. But since I have the Stamina and some tweaks as to how the combat will work, I suppose again, this should be fine. For example one could throw a die (or two to make it 2-12), consult the table, decide whether to use stamina to change the result, apply result... but I guess I will change this one yet. And lastly, yes, the balancing will be the toughest part, but I am working on that as I make the pages of the book, decide how many times a different skill will help you, how to avoid deaths player cannot influence, and stuff... you know what I mean Well thank you, and if you have anything to add, I will be happy to read it.
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Post by outspaced on Jun 4, 2013 13:59:10 GMT
There's more information about the series I mentioned on the Gamebooks website run by Demian Katz.
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Post by gdv82 on Jun 5, 2013 20:15:31 GMT
Is the entire Lone Wolf world also copyrighted? What about creating a new series of books where the hero is a new Kai Warrior?? Wouldn't he be almost bound to be sharing the same Disciplines as Lone Wolf (and all the other Kai Warriors)?? I'm asking so because I was thinking, in the long run, after I am finished with Lone Wolf Saga for Android, to try and write a new series based on a New Order Kai Warrior.... I already have a few ideas, but if the entire Lone Wolf universe is copyrighted, I will have to re-think that one through So, what do you know about the copyrights for the Kai Order, Sommerlund, and the characters you encounter through the "standard" series??
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Post by beowuuf on Jun 5, 2013 20:31:17 GMT
All copyrighted. They are all JD's characters and creations.
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Post by hellebore on Mar 26, 2014 9:46:52 GMT
You cannot copyright game mechanics, only there specific expression.
Hellebore
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Post by Zipp on Jun 23, 2014 4:40:40 GMT
I do believe the CR table is copyrighted, correct?
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Post by beowuuf on Jun 23, 2014 17:39:45 GMT
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Post by Snowshadow on Jun 24, 2014 6:39:34 GMT
The (LW) CR Table is copywrited but surely a CR Table of your own design is not.
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