New Release: Seventh Sense S

[mrscott75]

Thank you so much for continuing Dave's work! Seventh Sense is my favorite way to play Joe Dever's gamebooks. I am super excited for you to add the Grey Star series and even the Highway Warrior series! I love both of those series and am looking forward to a player like those I am used to seeing for Lone Wolf. Keep up the good work and I'll be watching your progress.

There is one minor glitch I found that I will post in the appropriate thread. Other than that, I agree with most of the other changes you have made.

[Banjo]

I had no idea Seventh Sense had been updated ("unofficially" or otherwise) until today... this is fantastic!

So, Seventh Sense S is the most current, best way to play the Deververse books as of 2018? I was planning to play through them (never played the last few) and would love to use something like this.

Also, is there any timeframe on the Greystar and Freeway Warrior books being added? I'm particularly interested in the latter, and would be very willing to help make such a thing happen, whatever was still needed to be done. I'm a big fan of the FW books and would be more than happy to help with getting them playable in Sixth Sense S.

I actually discovered Seventh Sense S while downloading the source for the original program with the intent to look at adding the FW books myself (either so they could also be played or as an alternate SS build), but seeing this later release has made me pause. If there is no intention to add the remaining FW books to SSS, is the source code available to SSS for me to try myself? I'm happy to work with the original source, but obviously the later version would be better if things have been improved, especially since adding them already seems to have least been planned (since the cover and menu options are there).

One other SSS question: is it possible to add custom covers for books (i.e. I grew up with certain LW covers and would like to have those selectable in the menu)?

[John Bryntze]

May 7, 2018 8:28:01 GMT Banjo said:

I had no idea Seventh Sense had been updated ("unofficially" or otherwise) until today... this is fantastic!

So, Seventh Sense S is the most current, best way to play the Deververse books as of 2018? I was planning to play through them (never played the last few) and would love to use something like this.

Also, is there any timeframe on the Greystar and Freeway Warrior books being added? I'm particularly interested in the latter, and would be very willing to help make such a thing happen, whatever was still needed to be done. I'm a big fan of the FW books and would be more than happy to help with getting them playable in Sixth Sense S.

I actually discovered Seventh Sense S while downloading the source for the original program with the intent to look at adding the FW books myself (either so they could also be played or as an alternate SS build), but seeing this later release has made me pause. If there is no intention to add the remaining FW books to SSS, is the source code available to SSS for me to try myself? I'm happy to work with the original source, but obviously the later version would be better if things have been improved, especially since adding them already seems to have least been planned (since the cover and menu options are there).

One other SSS question: is it possible to add custom covers for books (i.e. I grew up with certain LW covers and would like to have those selectable in the menu)?

UrQuan has fantastically continue this and release books super fast, you can play all 1-20 with Seventh Sense S, so yes this is the one to use

[jf]

ProjectAon updated the book resource recently. Now when downloading the most recent book, Seventh Sense crash with the most resent book.
Is that fixed?

[malfi]

Wow this is amazing news! And all books are released. Kai's blessing to the OP!

I just tried transfering my old profiles and though it starts me from the end of Book 17, which is fine but the picture is totally borked. Aon licence is missing. And basically i cant clock on anything

Has this happened to anyone else?

[saladdays]

May 7, 2018 18:18:49 GMT John Bryntze said:

UrQuan has fantastically continue this and release books super fast, you can play all 1-20 with Seventh Sense S, so yes this is the one to use

Well, then there's also the New Order series for which UrQuan has released the first four of them, I believe.

[Ofecks]

Is there a way to replace illustrations? Basically, I want to change out some of Chalk's horrifying nightmare fuel with pictures of something pleasant (like cats or something :3). I found what I think is the location where the program pulls the PA data from (C:\Users\<user>\AppData\Roaming\Project Aon\Seventh Sense\data\books). Would it be as easy as swapping the .gifs in the zip file for other .gifs of the same dimensions? Or just deleting them altogether?

e: Apparently replacing a file will cause a "MISSING FILE!" error on the text display. I guess the program does CRC checks on the files. Fine, but I would like an option to disable illustrations (that can be toggled on/off at any time), if that's possible. I thought there was an art setting previously but it was how to use the fan art, looks like.

What about the images for the medals? There's a certain one that I'd like to switch, but I'm guessing they're all buried in the .dat files which I have no idea how to read or modify. e: found the medals, looks like they're PNGs of various sizes. Gonna try and replace one. e2: Replaced the file, but the award did not trigger. Tried both as a fresh BtB character in the book before and as a fresh character in the book the award is given. Figured I didn't get it because I've been screwing with the files so I deleted everything and re-installed in a different location. If I get this particular award in the future, I'll try replacing the medal art then.

I once had a profile with a fuckton of the achievements unlocked. I might still have it backed up on an external HDD, although that would've been many program versions ago. Would it still work to copy over? e: yes, that works, but the profile I have archived is not the one where I had earned most of the medals, bummer.

More editing in some shower thoughts I had:

The various rulesets and awards system are already incredibly good for adding replayability to a format that normally isn't that conducive to it. I propose that it be taken a few steps further. To start, I really want you to re-implement the Hardcore mode that was present before. This new one is cool but it needs to be a separate ruleset. That said...

A) I'm thinking in terms of a commercial product that you would buy on Steam, for instance. The unlocking of award hints by completing series on the various difficulties is really good, keep that. Maybe make it so on a fresh profile, there's a progressive unlock system. For the rulesets, only BtB should be available at the start. Completing a series should unlock HC and Prodigy for that series. Then completing HC unlocks your new HC mode and Custom rules. I noticed in your OP you said you nerfed Prodigy characters... I would advise against that as Prodigy is meant to be an easy mode (I think?). e: I guess I or someone else requested this very thing of vanilla years ago, and Dave made a good argument as to why he did it the way he did. It's something to think about but having reviewed the evidence against a progressive unlocking of gameplay rules, I don't consider it important anymore.

B) Would there be a way to maybe stagger the section paragraphs so they don't all appear at once? As in, require a click on a stylized arrow or something to advance the text. And maybe the text can animate or fade in.
Specifically I'm thinking of paragraphs that require an action (item pickup, endurance loss/restore, etc.), and the section endcaps, whether they be your choices, a "turn to", a RNT prompt, or an ending ("your life and your quest end here"). Especially for that last part. If I'm reading a LW adventure for the first time and I end up in a section where it's an obvious death, my brain instantly goes "welp" and I only sort of half-read the section text. I dunno, I think it would have more impact if it weren't immediately obvious when reaching the section, which kind of spoilers itself in a way. Of course, this should be an optional setting on repeat reads on the same profile. Have the program track every section that has been read before and disable it (if the option is chosen) for future speed-reads. e: Also, having an arrow to click after a death passage would allow you to process and grant any awards earned and bring up the white "you have died" box like if you lost in combat.

C) I enjoy arcade games and the scoring systems in them. I propose that a scoring system be added to Seventh Sense. The current Hall of Fame is a great thing, but I think it can be expanded. Picking up items, using Disciplines, winning fights, winning awards, etc. could all award various amounts of points, with a bonus at the end of a successful completion of each book that varies depending on how much you scored during the adventure (and how much of a handicap you had in the HC modes). Naturally, some things would be worth more points than others. Acquiring the Firesphere would be worth more than acquiring a Bone Sword. Getting an achivement/award would be a huge chunk of points, the magnitude of which is determined by it's difficulty rating and/or some other metric. I can definitely see myself analyzing the books and awards to find out the proper set-ups and paths to get the most points in a single run. As far as items go, I realize that it could spoiler what items are important and what are not, so this system should be optional. Or at least having an option to disable any on-screen notifications and scoresheet.

D) Regarding awards, unless it is logically required, awards should be given the moment all criteria has been met, not at the end of the book. In addition, it would be neat if you got some kind of notification that you made some progress on an award for those with multiple requirements per book. Like a glowing orb on the UI somewhere that gives a lore-friendly toolip ("A small piece of Aonic essence has locked into place.", "Your actions have altered the threads of fate." etc.) and disappears when clicked. Doesn't have to completely spoil the award, but it would be nice to have feedback on your progress. High and Low combat progress, and I'm not sure what else, should be exempt from notifications. I'm just talking about tricky stuff that's harder to track by the player. e: Apparently this has been requested of vanilla SS as well a long time ago.

E) Would it be possible to add a gender selection? It'd be cosmetic/flavor-only, of course. You'd have to change pronouns and stuff like lord -> lady, sir -> ma'am, etc. Might be a lot of work, I dunno.

[tortle]

1. What's the deal with special items within Seventh Sense?
Like in Castle Death there is something called a "Fine Spear" with bonuses.
These aren't in the original books but I like them, is there a list of the these special items?

2. What about implementing a Red Herring Award System?

The user has to collect a certain amount of red herrings, and is then rewarded accordingly.
This would open up the books by making you take non-traditional paths within the books to collect the red herrings.

There could even be rewards like you get a special item or potions for the next book by collecting enough red herrings from the previous book. This will also compensate you for taking those different paths.

[jf]

Jun 24, 2018 18:48:12 GMT tortle said:

1. What's the deal with special items within Seventh Sense?
Like in Castle Death there is something called a "Fine Spear" with bonuses.
These aren't in the original books but I like them, is there a list of the these special items?

2. What about implementing a Red Herring Award System?

The user has to collect a certain amount of red herrings, and is then rewarded accordingly.
This would open up the books by making you take non-traditional paths within the books to collect the red herrings.

There could even be rewards like you get a special item or potions for the next book by collecting enough red herrings from the previous book. This will also compensate you for taking those different paths.

1. It's what the original book name them ("you find a fine Spear and..."). The bonus is only in Prodigy Mode, it's a alternate way of playing from the original books. It a attempt to fix some imbalance and give more deep in a way that would have been difficult to implement in paper book and player sheet. The mode remain challenging by other change like nurfing the Sommerswerd.

2. Some awards are given in similar fashion. Prodigy sometime reward rarely use path with nice item/object.

[Ofecks]

Jun 24, 2018 18:48:12 GMT tortle said:

1. What's the deal with special items within Seventh Sense?
Like in Castle Death there is something called a "Fine Spear" with bonuses.
These aren't in the original books but I like them, is there a list of the these special items?

As jf said, the bonus is only in Prodigy mode. The special name of the weapon will appear in all modes, and yes, they're fun to discover and collect.

There are awards for having collected a certain threshold of weapons in both the Kai and Magnakai series. Spoiler: Weapons-as-Special-Items ('Swerd, Jewelled Mace, etc.) and these "named" regular weapons usually count as 2. Here's a full list from the vanilla SS source code (spoilers, of course). The book 1 weapons can only be kept in Prodigy mode, as you do not get storage until book 5 in BtB and HC, and oddly, a few are being checked that you can't keep in any way.

* Spoiler start *
Prince Pelathar's Sword [can't keep in BtB/HC]
Giak Spear [can't keep in BtB/HC]
Hermit's Warhammer [can't keep in BtB/HC]
Card Sharp's Dagger
Magic Spear
Fine Broadsword (A)
Szall Spear
Sommerswerd
Bone Sword
Bone Dagger
Bone Mace
Captain D'Val's Sword [can't keep]
Whip [no bonus]
Dagger of Vashna
Blowpipe
Sleep Dart [no bonus]
Jewelled Mace
Jakan
Cracked Jakan [no bonus, but you can't keep these anyway]
Kalte Bow [shouldn't have a bonus because of the penalty it imposes on you, can't keep it anyway]
Durense Bow [can't keep]
Silver Bow of Duadon
Bronin Warhammer
Arla's Axe
Heavy Sword
Fine Broadsword (B)
Fine Spear
Paido's Sword [can't keep]
Monk's Sword
Senate Broadsword
Senate Mace
Senate Short Sword
Senate Bow
Senate Dagger
Maghana Dagger
Maghana Spear
Maghana Bow
Bullwhip
Death Knight Broadword
Death Knight Axe
Ironheart Broadsword [can't keep]
Scarlet Warrior's Sword
Yoacor Dagger
Helshezag
Zejar'dulaga Arrow

You need 11 total for 1-5 and 25 total for 1-12.
- Spoiler end -

Jun 24, 2018 18:48:12 GMT tortle said:

2. What about implementing a Red Herring Award System?

The user has to collect a certain amount of red herrings, and is then rewarded accordingly.
This would open up the books by making you take non-traditional paths within the books to collect the red herrings.

Yup, these awards are in there as well. Here's the list:

* Spoiler start *
Vordak Gem, 20 Gems, Scroll, Message, Soap [you can't keep any of the book 1 backpack items to the end of the series in BtB/HC rules]
Documents
Fur Blanket
Blanket
Gold Ring [counts at 5(!) items in 1-5 but only 1 towards the 1-12 total]
Silver Token [don't think you can keep this?]
Sleeping Furs
Diamond
Gold Bracelet [can't keep either of these]
Tent
Onyx Medallion
Whip [also counts towards the weapon award]
Shovel
Pickaxe
Hourglass
Towel
Prism
Silver Comb
Canteen of water
Wine
Mirror
Ruby Ring
Silver Brooch
Parchment
Flask of Wine
Silver Sceptre [not sure if SS lets you keep this]
Bottle of Water
Silver Box
Sack of Silver
Grey Crystal Ring
Finger Guard
Wood Bow Case
Leather Bow Case
Bowstring
Lodestone
Giak Scroll
Silver Bowl
Gold Dust
Altar Cloth
Scroll of Honour
Jadin Anklet
Spyglass
Flask of Water
Psychic Ring
Comb
Flask of Boza
Silver Candlestick
Silver Goblet
Silk Packet
Crystal Decanter
Medal
Signet Ring
Silver Rod
Conch Shell
Tobacco
Pipe

You need 13 in 1-5 (as well as 85 crowns) and 40 in 1-12 (as well as 200 total GC worth across all currencies [although it only checks for at least 1 of each]).
- Spoiler end -

There's also a potion one! I'm not typing all those out because A) they're mostly self-explanatory and B) they're not listed in the comments in the source code like the others. A few unusual items in the Kai series count towards this (spoiler): Flask of Holy Water, Herb Pad (Special Item), Bottle of Kourshah.

Currently I'm doing a project to figure out how many awards I can get in one pass. It's been extremely tricky to plan all it out, but I'm learning the books and award requirements inside-out in the process.

[tortle]

Thanks for the replies. It's great that Prodigy encourages alternate routes through the books.

What about making the Bronin Warhammer a more tempting option?

Like giving it a +3 CS instead of just +1?

Otherwise the choice of the silver bow is too easy.

It would be cool to do a run of the books where the Bronin Warhammer was a more compelling choice over the bow.

[Ofecks]

In case you weren't aware, the vast majority of awards you can get in any ruleset, not just Prodigy. The project I'm working on is using BtB rules. Last time I played Prodigy was a billion versions ago in vanilla SS.

There are awards for all 3 of the post-Quarlen attractions in book 6. Also they each contain objectives for other awards, and at least one of them is required for an award in a future book. It's not very intuitive to figure out what exactly these objectives are sometimes, but that's what the hints are for.

If you're planning a full MK playthrough the warhammer is useful if you choose to leave the Sommerswerd in storage (or if you manage to lose it; yes that's possible) for certain books. Plus that path gives you get a 6 EP Potion for use in that book and the next.

[tortle]

I noticed that I can't select Prodigy in the Gameplay rules, it's greyed out.
I can only choose Custom or standard

[Ofecks]

You might need to complete a BtB or HC playthrough of the series in which you want it enabled.

Just checked it myself and starting a new campaign I can only select BtB and HC, Prodigy and Custom are greyed out for me. I have no idea why. I know that SSS' new hardcore mode can only be started with book 1.

[tortle]

For a challenge, I tried starting a new campaign on book 7, but could only select custom rules

Started with CS 17 E 30

Got my CS up to 24 with Weaponmastery and finding the armor and helmet early in book 7 (with custom rules)