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Post by Gazguz on Jan 13, 2005 8:26:46 GMT
I have always played the game assuming that you can carry multiple quivers. Each quiver being a special item holding 6 arrows. I normally restrict myself to a maximum of two quivers for a maximum of 12 arrows.
What do you think of my interpretation?
Do you think it is OK to do this or is this cheating?
Regarding the rules is it cheating to have multiple special items that are weapons and weapons as well.
What I mean is that it is repeated stated that only two weapons may be carried at any one time but at certain points of the game I have the Sommerswerd, the dagger of Vashna, the Silver bow of Duadon and a Shield which are all special items which means I can also carry an Axe and a mace or two other normal weapons as well.
I have always thought the two weapons only rule was kind of strange when you meet up with characters like Viveka in the story book that quite clearly break those rules with plenty of bladed and other weapons secreted on her person.
The people I have spoken to who have been into real combat take more than just one or two personal weapons. It is just natural to have an extra knife in your boot and a folding knive for multipurpose use in a chest pocket and in his case a machine pistol as well as his automatic sniper rifle.
Perhaps I am just being fussy as the way the rules stand you can carry quite a few weapons as long as most are special items, but then you get the situation where you are stripped of "all" of your weapons but left with the Sommerswerd... the most powerful sword of them all...
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Post by North Star on Jan 13, 2005 14:12:14 GMT
This question has come up time and time again. I think that most people treat the special weapons as just that - Special Items and Weapons, taking no other Weapons if they already have three or more Special Weapons.
NS.
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Post by Sol on Jan 13, 2005 16:21:59 GMT
Yep - word to North Star.
The Two Weapon Limit only applies to "normal" weapons rather than Weapon-Like-Special-Items. So you can only have two normal weapons, but you can have LOTS of Special Item Weapons.
This may seem strange, but the rules are drawn up to be fairly simple.
I used to wonder if I could / should place my Shield in the Weapons slot. I also considered putting a Quiver in the Weapons slot. Why? Well, the shield is held in the hand - wouldn't it then replace the hand that would usually be holding my weapon? As for the Quiver, later in the series, I just have so little use for those weapon slots. Why not place a bow in one slot and a quiver in the other?
That I admit is some VERY creative book-keeping. Many of us already put the Sommerswerd (Special Item) in a Weapons slot, so this is sort of an extension of this.
Another idea: Skip the categories. Give Lone Wolf a super-big backpack. It holds 22 (2+8+12) items and has a little pouch on the side for gold (50 GC max). Then be done with it!
Gazguz, to answer your original question, it does not seem like cheating to have two quivers. If it makes you happy, go for it. There is usually little game advantage anyway since I have never used up all my arrows (although I once dumped them all by accident in Book 7). I say go for it. Maybe if you had 2 at the start of Book 10 that would be useful since you can't just get more at the start of Book 11.
Sol
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Post by Peregrine on Jan 13, 2005 16:56:37 GMT
The 'official' rules as I understand them are: 1. Two normal Weapons. 2. Any number of Weapon-like Special Items (up to the Special Items limit if applicable). 3. Any time a Weapon is mentioned (particularly if it's being lost or destroyed), it refers to a normal Weapon - only if you have none do you lose a Special Item. 4. Any time ALL Weapons are mentioned (e.g. when you're being captured and disarmed), it includes Weapon-like Special Items as well.
It may not make much sense from a realism point of view, but that's what the book rules, and certain newsletter clarifications, suggest. Most people who want a more realistic system at least start with those, or so it seems to me.
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Post by Black Cat on Jan 13, 2005 17:27:52 GMT
I don't remember seeing a place where it states that you can't take more than one quiver with you. As for the weapon-like-special-items, the real rule is like Peregrine stated it, although I never played like that: I'm putting my Sommerswerd in a Weapon's slot everytime.
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Post by niftysunburn on Jan 13, 2005 21:01:22 GMT
Personally, I keep Special Weapons in my hands (only 2 obviously). Since it tells you in the text where you store the other special weapons I just assume they're on my person throughout the book and I can exchange them if need be.
As for the quiver, I always figured you could strap one on either hip and one your back if you were so inclined. Not that you need that many arrows. My two bits on the matter.
ns
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Post by Zipp on Jan 14, 2005 19:06:06 GMT
I just carried one quiver but assumed it could carry very many arrows.
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Post by Sol on Jan 14, 2005 21:00:19 GMT
I just carried one quiver but assumed it could carry very many arrows. That's an interesting point - it might not actually say that six arrows is the maximum capacity. It only says that there are six in there... Zipp, I like your idea. Next time I play, I may try to reach 100 arrows.
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Post by Peregrine on Jan 14, 2005 21:29:11 GMT
That's exactly what I always thought -- right up until I first played a PA edition using Statskeeper, I think. (I also used to fill in the quiver section, not with numbers or tally marks, but with little drawings of arrows... Come to think of it, isn't that bit of the Action Chart rather large for a maximum of six arrows?)
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Post by Sol on Jan 14, 2005 22:41:04 GMT
I stick that awesome magical-poison arrow from Book 12 in my quiver as well.
What if you don't use that arrow in Book 12? Can you ever use it again?
(Zeda-Dejuz or whatever it was called??)
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Post by Sol on Jan 14, 2005 22:43:42 GMT
There's also a cool Archery Shoppe in Book 6 where you can buy all kinds of cool (worthless) stuff for your Silver Bow like a Bow Case, wristguards, and lots more. Would be nice if some of these did something however! I think if you put a Bow in the Bowcase that it should only take up one space.
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Post by North Star on Jan 15, 2005 17:53:00 GMT
Zejar-Dulaga. And I would keep 12 arrows in there, in keeping with traditional quivers.
NS.
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Post by Zipp on Jan 16, 2005 7:45:13 GMT
That's exactly what I always thought -- right up until I first played a PA edition using Statskeeper, I think. (I also used to fill in the quiver section, not with numbers or tally marks, but with little drawings of arrows... Come to think of it, isn't that bit of the Action Chart rather large for a maximum of six arrows?) Totally. I did this too. I still draw little arrows.
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Post by Gazguz on Jan 16, 2005 9:23:27 GMT
Sorry for the delay with this reply but:
The main reason I carried two quivers was to allow me to carry up to 12 arrows. For a single special item space this allowed me to pick up more arrows from killed enemies at a time and it also means if there is no opportunity to get another quiver at the start of a game I don't run out so quickly. This usually meant that when I was given the opportunity of picking 1 or 2 items at the start of a book I didn't have to worry about chosing quivers so often as there are enough bow armed enemies plus shops that will sell arrows that I didn't need to worry about running out during an adventure.
I realise that the system is a bit simplified to making it more appealing to a broader audience but I would like to both adhere to the rules and be realistic at the same time.
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Post by Sol on Jan 16, 2005 15:51:03 GMT
Is it realistic to carry two quivers?
Well, usually you sling it over your shoulder, so I could see you having 2. If you don't think you could sling two quivers over the same shoulder, well, fortunately you have two shoulders.
Of course, this can be a slippery slope since isn't your shield also slung over your shoulder?
This brings us to our next point:
THE OLD SPECIAL ITEMS SYSTEM In Book 1, you were not limited to 12 items, but I had the feeling that you were supposed to keep track of where your items were. For example, every item you find "tells you how you are supposed to carry it." For example, weapons are carried "in the hand" or the chainmail waistcoat is worn "on the body." So if you are keeping track of where everything is, you need to be mindful of the fact that two items might occupy the same space - in that case, you might have to consider dropping one.
THE NEW 12 ITEM SYSTEM Dever probably gave up on this since players never do this. By giving 12 items as the max (and specifying which special items take up no space like notes and letters) it just simplifies the above system, even if it does cut down on the realism a little.
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